Power Beyond Pride 6: Activism, Advocacy, and the Arts with PBP Co-Host Kenyon Farrow

Kenyon (00:00:01 –> 00:00:26):
I think especially now, we actually people, we need everybody to be active. And so I don’t think trying to gloss over the real crisis that we’re in is not helpful for your clients. It will not be helpful for them because what happens when an executive order or something or what Congress defunds everything? You need to be able to prepare them for that now and hopefully activate those folks to stop as much damage from happening.

Daniel (00:00:27 –> 00:00:44):
Hello, and welcome to Power Beyond Pride, a queer change making podcast, bringing you voices and ideas from across our fierce and fabulous spectrum to transform our world. I am Daniel W.K. lee, poet, author, and mall leader, maid manager.

Mattie (00:00:45 –> 00:01:15):
And I am Maddie, your other co host. I am, um, fabulous and beautiful, I will say TV personality, future author, and single. Ready to mingle in this episode. We are. She’s talking to a multifaceted, brilliant writer, editor, health strategist, and member of Power Beyond Pride podcast host himself. Yes. The amazing Kenyon Farrow. Ah, I’m loving it. Hey, Kenyon.

Kenyon (00:01:16 –> 00:01:19):
Hey, what’s up, Maddie? How you doing, Daniel? It’s good to be here.

Mattie (00:01:21 –> 00:01:27):
So Kenyon’s work focuses on public health and infectious disease, with a focus on racial, gender, and economic justice.

Daniel (00:01:27 –> 00:01:53):
Kenyon is also the communications director with AVAC and the former managing director of advocacy and organizing with Prep4All. He currently serves on the boards of the LGBT center of Greater Cleveland and Partners for Dignity and Rights. A prolific essayist and author is published at City Limits, HuffPost, and the American Prospect. Welcome, Kenyon.

Kenyon (00:01:54 –> 00:01:56):
Thank you. Good to see you, Daniel. Glad to be here.

Mattie (00:01:57 –> 00:02:07):
So, Kenyon, after we thanked you two and three and four times for taking time out, uh, of your busy schedule to be here with us, what’s been going on?

Kenyon (00:02:08 –> 00:04:56):
I mean, obviously folks know all of the insanity we’ve been dealing with with this, the Trump administration, and specifically where I sort of come into that. So. As communications director with AVAC. So AVAC is a organization that’s been around. This is our 30th anniversary, actually. And the work that we do is really around bringing equitable access to biomedical prevention, primarily focused on eastern southern Africa. Right. So we have, or we had, I should say, uh, a grant with USAID to do a lot of that work. And as folks know, on January 20th, with all of the executive orders that were issued, uh, there was a stop payment order on all, quote, unquote, foreign assistance payments, so, which included us. And so they withheld payment for the work that we were contracted to do for usaid. And that caused us to have to lay off about a third of our Staff that grant with USAID is about 40% of our budget. And. But we didn’t take it lying down. We sued the administration and big shout out to public citizen who has represented us in this case. And the lawsuit is still working, uh, its way through the court. But in the sort of first part of the lawsuit, the judgment they were the government was forced to pay us and also all other grantees of USAID money that they owed for January and February of this year for work. So one that’s obviously created a whole bunch of disruption, right? In just like global health, it’s created disruptions in, like, people being able to access prep and access care in a lot of places around the world and then also created disruptions in organizations and us having to lay off a lot of folks. And so as communications director, while we’re in the middle of the lawsuit, I have been doing a whole lot of work with, so the media strategy and as it pertains to this. So it’s kind of just thrown our work up and not necessarily in a new direction, but we’ve had to take on this, this fight not just for us, but for the work that we do and for other organizations and for the people that we serve who need access to prevention in Africa. So. So that’s what my 2025 has been like.

Mattie (00:04:56 –> 00:05:25):
2025, it sounds like it’s been busy thus far. So, um, real quick, before we move forward, I do want to segue just a little bit into that for people who don’t know what all those us, usad, and if I’m saying it correctly, usaid. Right. US and your, your organization with it now, the presidential administration stopping certain things. What does that stop? Like, what all does that entail?

Kenyon (00:05:26 –> 00:09:10):
Yeah, so a lot of what we do just to say, give you a perspective on the work. So it included everything from, like, organizations like ours that one of the things that we did was regrant a lot of the money that we got from USAID to African organizations who are doing the work on the ground. Some of them are training community members to advocate in their countries for more prep access. Some of them specifically work with adolescent teenage girls and young women around those issues. Some of them work with LGBTQ folks in Africa and making sure. And also doing the advocacy to make sure that countries that still have very homophobic, uh, and transphobic laws on the books that people are able to kind of fight at least to have access to prep and to HIV treatment in those countries and also to advocate for the kinds of clinical trial research that happens in those countries. So we do a lot of training of community advocates who can sit at the table with medical doctors and PhD level researchers and advocate for what those clinical trials should look like in their countries. So those clinical trials are being executed with a level of kind of equity, social justice and human rights in mind as they roll those trials out. So that’s a lot of the work that we do. So the impact of losing that and the impact of what happened to usaid. So USAID, or USAID as some, some people refer to it, is a government agency in the United States that really was in the business of helping to fund different kind of humanitarian projects globally. Right. So USAID does everything from build roads and bridges in countries. Again in the work I’m in, in HIV and public health, we do a lot of support, they do a lot of, done a lot of support to build up the capacity of countries to manage health concerns and particularly in infectious disease crises, etc. And so what has happened with. They have basically just gutted, they fired most of the USAID staff. USAID was a, its own kind of entity. And what they have done is sort of move the office under the US Department of State, which makes it a political organization. Right. Or it politicizes. Right. The work in a particular way. And, and then, you know, and then there were just some trials for their new prep modalities that were underway in clinical research trials or things that are being worked on that we don’t even talk about. Right. So work around for particularly CIS women and trans guys, like a uh, dual prevention pill. So you could get one pill that would be contraception and PrEP in one pill. Right. Those are clinical trials or vaginal rings that people could insert vaginally that would last three to six months that would prevent HIV single use. There’s a new kind of like sort of prep that is being or prep modalities that have been studied or looked at now that are like an anal suppository that you take once it prevents HIV for 24 hours. Right. So you only. It’s a one use product, you don’t take a pill every day or these kinds of things. Right. Which I think are the kind of products that people really want. Right. People don’t necessarily want to be on a pill every day for prep. And so a lot of that to look at these different kinds of products and how you implement them in countries is totally at risk. And also in some trials that were being funded by USAID for certain things just completely closed. So now we have. And you can’t just start those things over tomorrow.

Mattie (00:09:10 –> 00:09:10):
Right.

Kenyon (00:09:10 –> 00:09:22):
It takes years to do the kind of groundwork and kind of get it back. So even if they turn the lights back on at USAID tomorrow, we’ve already lost years worth of work that will be very hard to get back.

Daniel (00:09:22 –> 00:09:30):
Unintended consequences for thoughtless actions by the administration. It’s absolutely wild.

Kenyon (00:09:30 –> 00:09:36):
Yeah, yeah. Thoughtless, but. Or I would say careless. It was thoughtful. They thought about it.

Mattie (00:09:36 –> 00:09:38):
Yeah, I agree with you on that one.

Daniel (00:09:39 –> 00:09:44):
Yeah. Maybe it’s not even. Maybe it’s actually just malicious really.

Kenyon (00:09:44 –> 00:09:45):
Right, Absolutely.

Daniel (00:09:45 –> 00:09:46):
It’s malice driven.

Mattie (00:09:47 –> 00:09:53):
It was very well thought out. Project 2025 was very well thought out. They know what they’re doing. Yeah.

Daniel (00:09:53 –> 00:10:30):
Riding on your kind of professional, some, some more of your professional skills. Like how would you, I mean, from, uh, as someone who deals in communications, how would you advise, like other kind of smaller non profits who are trying to figure out their messaging, their, their how to communicate their needs and what’s going on and to their clientele, their. Or the people that they’re served. Make sense of the moment to, to the people they serve. Do you have any?

Kenyon (00:10:30 –> 00:14:41):
Yeah. Oh, I think so. First of all, like, it was surprising to us in some respects. Like we KNEW Certainly Project 2025 was calling for, but we didn’t just enter. Those of us who also work on the, in the global space didn’t anticipate that like usaid and that would be the first thing that they came for, uh, as soon as Trump was inaugurated. And, and now I can see why. Because for a lot of people in the United States, a lot of the kind of international humanitarian work that USAID or even other agencies like CDC does some global work or FDA does some global work or whatever, and certainly NIH as a research institution does a lot of international research work. Right. So they started there because that’s the stuff that Americans don’t pay enough attention to. Right. And don’t think that it has any relevance to their daily lives. Right. And so what I’ve been saying to people in this country is if you look at what they did with usaid, they are going to do that here. Right. And so now we’re beginning to start to see the ways in which they have already gutted and laying off people at various federal agencies. And the way that that is going to roll down is it’s not just people’s jobs in D.C. is federal agencies all over this country. I’m in Cleveland, Ohio. There’s a Federal Reserve bank office here in Cleveland that They are threatening to sell the building. Right. That the government owns. And none of those workers know whether they’re going to have a job or whether they’re going to uh, have an office. Right. Moving forward. So not only does it impact that or people who work for federal government, but I’ve been telling people think about it this way. So one, if you work for a community organization, a nonprofit, this is going to impact the state funding that you’re able to get. Because a lot of state funding comes from the federal government that go, that gets then allocated to states. They then allocated to counties and cities. And so if they lay off all those people either there will be nobody to just literally cut the checks. Right. And that’s part of what they’re banking on. So that’s one issue. And I think the other issue is. So it’s not just that you lose the funding that a lot of particularly organizations that do community m like to do social services. Right? A lot of that is federal funding. Even if it’s coming from your city or county and state, it’s mostly federal money. So there’ll be impacts there. And the other piece that I think we aren’t talking enough about is what also what does it mean when you know it’s not just the people who work in those jobs but you to think about like if you’re in a city where there’s say I’ve used this as an example in like ah, a Instagram reel I made. So if you’re in Birmingham, Alabama, right. Uh, the University of uh, Alabama. Birmingham is a major resource research institutions and they do a lot of HIV research specifically. So we’re talking tens of millions of dollars that is now being taken out of Alabama, which is not the wealthiest state and in fact it’s probably one of the poorest states in the country. Right? So you’re taking money out of that institution but it doesn’t just impact the institution. Think about the people who come to Birmingham like I do sometimes for meetings there, right? So that’s flights, that’s not. That are not happening, right? So that’s airlines impacted, that’s Ubers and taxi drivers, right. Who are not taking people back and forth from the airport or the meetings. That’s businesses like restaurants and people who cater, right. Who cater. People who have catering businesses that cater meetings or people go out to lunch at the local, whatever’s around said office or whatever. The people who do hair or uh, cut hair. All of that is impacted by 20 year old with a laptop working for Doge in an office. So the impacts of this are going to be actually very far reaching. And so if people think that, oh, I don’t work in a nonprofit or I don’t do HIV work or I don’t work with the trans community or this, that or whatever, you still may be impacted by any of these things because of the ripple effects it’ll have in the economy down the way.

Mattie (00:14:42 –> 00:15:14):
Oh, most definitely. Most definitely. Well, Kenya, I am enjoying our conversation and I, uh, just uh. We have to take a quick break real quick. We will be back, but I need everybody to understand that Kenyon is just getting started and we are just about to start having fun. So stick with us and we’ll be right. Welcome back to Power Beyond Pride. I am Maddie here with the wonderful Daniel and we are talking to the amazing Kenya. So, Daniel, I think you had a question.

Daniel (00:15:15 –> 00:15:56):
Yeah, I just wanted to kind of like expand a little bit more upon that thread a bit, um, what you were saying earlier and think about what, what is the strategy for smaller organizations in terms of communicating with what’s kind of going on in kind of the landscape, maybe their funding or whatever, like, whatever the repercussions of these executive orders means to the organizations. And is there a such thing as like telling their, their client or their, the people that they serve too much information to, I don’t know, create sympathy with what’s happening? What’s your perspective on that?

Kenyon (00:15:56 –> 00:18:00):
Yeah, I, I don’t think people should, should lie or, or obfuscate or treat their clients or patients or people that they serve with, with kid gloves around it. Because it’s that serious, right? I, I don’t think so. I am, um, personally of the opinion that we spend I think too much time within a lot of social service agencies in the country, especially I think even with HIV ones who got their start because people were activists and organized to fight for those services to exist in the first place. But we have moved to just treating people as just client. They only there to get their whatever the social services that they need as opposed to these are folks in our community who, who actually can be organized to actually help impact the change that we want to see. And so I think people should be straight up with and say, look, this is the situation, this is the constraints that we’re potentially under and this is the threat that we have. And I think, I think people should be, be very honest about that. And hopefully if those organizations don’t have like community organizing or uh, leadership development training or uh, ways for people to be plugged easily into Activism first. Um, of all, I think every organization should be doing that, right? Not just having people who are there for, there for services, but people should be also be built as like community leaders to affect change, local, state, national, what have you. But I think especially now, we actually people, we need everybody to be active. And so I don’t think, uh, trying to gloss over the real crisis that we’re in is not helpful for your clients. It will not be helpful for them. Because what happens when an executive order or something or what congress, the MAGA Congress that we have defunds everything? You need to be able to prepare them for that now. Right. And hopefully activate those folks to stop as much damage from happening.

Daniel (00:18:00 –> 00:18:01):
Absolutely.

Mattie (00:18:01 –> 00:18:58):
Well, I do want to shift gears just a little bit, Mr. M. Kenyon, and talk a little bit about your essay work. So what, uh, most people don’t know about you, or I ain’t gonna say most people don’t know about you, but one of the things that our viewers or listeners may not know about you is that you are a prolific essayist and author. You are the co editor of the book Letters from a Young Activist, Today’s Rebels to Speak Out. You have been up here, you have appeared in many of anthologies, including Healing Just this Crisis of, uh, Care, Queer Response to a Global Pandemic. There you’ve been featured on BET.com you have been in the magazine Medium, Pause, the Atlantic out, the Columbus Dispatch, the Griot Color Line, Logo, Rewire, News, and the list goes on and on and.

Kenyon (00:18:58 –> 00:19:00):
On and on and on and on and on.

Mattie (00:19:00 –> 00:19:10):
That’s what we love about Suitcase. But I want to ask like, what do you see or how would you classify your journey in writing and what do you see it going?

Kenyon (00:19:11 –> 00:19:24):
Ah, uh, thank you. Yeah. So part of it is I, I started as a kid, I was, I actually started as a, as a dancer. I was, I started taking modern and jazz dance classes at 7 years old.

Mattie (00:19:25 –> 00:19:26):
How did I know you?

Kenyon (00:19:26 –> 00:20:41):
A lot of younger. Yeah, like a lot of young queens. I was the only boy in the class or whatnot. But. And then I, uh, later in um, like high school, I started doing more theater. We started acting more and then I majored in theater in undergrad. Now I always could write. I was always a good writer, even as a, as a young kid. So just one quick story. When I was like, I think in fifth grade, I ran for like student council, the elementary school, like president or vice president, I forget which, whatever won, but I won. And we all had to like all the winners had to of the Student council had to like, write an acceptance speech. And so I wrote. I wrote a speech like at whatever I was like 9 years old, 10 years or whatever it was. And as I just said in my head, I’m just like, writing what I thought I should write. And I remember giving the speech at the, like, school assembly or whatever. And I just remember the reaction from all the adults in the room was just like. People just like, stood up and applauded and like, all these things. And I was just. I was like, so, like, oh, okay. And of course my mother made me then give that speech at every goddamn Thanksgiving. And.

Mattie (00:20:44 –> 00:20:52):
You gotta love black mothers. I’m telling you, honey, when their baby get warm, your quality, they will expand. Want that quality? Yes, they will.

Kenyon (00:20:54 –> 00:21:30):
Yeah. So I was just like, man, get out of here. So. But that was a, uh. But I did. I. It was. I learned that I could write and that I’m good on my feet speaking. So I. So initially, when I’m. I moved to New York City, I lived in New York City for many, uh, years before I moved back to Cleveland here, where I’m, Where I’m from. And so when I moved to New York, I was. Moved to New York to be an actor. And that’s what I did. And I was, I was very much a, uh, I was a purist. I was, I was a theater person, darling. Classically trained. I don’t want to do television or film, honey, that is beneath me.

Mattie (00:21:32 –> 00:21:34):
Here we go. Here we go.

Kenyon (00:21:35 –> 00:23:51):
I was very. I was really that. But, you know, what happened was I just grew less interested in theater. They might have been like, the times I moved to New York in 1999 when I was like 24 years old. And then all this stuff was happening like 9, 11 happened. And ah, a lot of my friends were activists and organizers and were starting a lot of new queer organizations like Fierce in New York, Audre Lorde, Project Queers for Economic justice, which I later became Ed, uh, the executive director of and whatnot. And so it just started to feel less important to like, do another summer Shakespeare production in Connecticut or something or whatever. I just started to feel like I need to get involved in this work here. And part of that was also. Cause I wanted. I knew that I was also growing more interested in developing my voice as a. As a writer and as an essayist. And so the two things went together. So kind of my. My activist work really turned into like, communications and media strategy work for social justice causes. And then I developed my skills as an essayist. And then in um, 2006, I went to grad school and went to journalism school. Get the more training and credentials. That’s kind of how it happened. Oh, and so your second question, so we asked the second piece of that, which is like, where is it going? Okay, so people keep bugging me about like a memoir. People are like, it’s time for you to write a memoir. People been telling me that for 10 years and I have like hemmed and hawed. And now maybe just as I turn 50 in November, it feels like, okay, I feel old enough to write a memoir. So, um, I’ve taken some notes, I got a little bit of an outline. I know what I want to do. And I think part of it is not just, I don’t think it’ll be like a birth to this current moment, but I think really focus a lot on how I became an activist. And some of the work and all the, some of the, some of the work, to me that’s the most important happened in like the early mid 2000s, like I would say by between 1999 and like 2010, 2011 in terms of my own work. But a lot of that stuff isn’t really because this, this is like pre social media and we had the Internet and stuff, but this is like not people were not.

Mattie (00:23:51 –> 00:23:56):
There’s no Twitter, so aol. Mhm.

Kenyon (00:23:56 –> 00:24:32):
Yeah, right, right. We were barely past aol. Real People. It’s a lot of work particularly that I was involved in, particularly with a lot of black queer folks. I did a lot of work around a number of murders and attacks of black gay men that were happening in New York city in the mid 2000s and stuff. So there’s really no record of their records of some of those cases because some of them became very famous. But there’s really no record of the organizing and stuff that was happening. And so I feel like I want to really leave that behind. Yeah, I want to tell some of those stories about some of the work. So I think that’s, that’s, that’s coming. We’ll see.

Daniel (00:24:33 –> 00:24:39):
We’re going to take a short break here and get back to you in less than a minute. Continue our conversation with Kenyan.

Mattie (00:24:43 –> 00:25:01):
Well, welcome back to Power Beyond Pride, a queer change making podcast. I um, am your co host Maddie Bynum here with my co host, Mr. Daniel Lee. And we are talking to the fantastically fashionable as always, Kenyon Pharaohs. And Daniel, I think you had the next question.

Daniel (00:25:02 –> 00:25:35):
Yes. So as a writer and an editor, you’ve been quite prolific as Mattie had kind of listed your fantastic litany of credits, you’re including being a, uh, contributor to Abolition for the People, which was edited by former NFL player Colin Kaepernick. Could you tell us a little bit more about that experience and how do you think Kaepernick’s experience is instructive to people of color with a large. With a large platform?

Kenyon (00:25:36 –> 00:28:18):
Yeah, so, so one, I was completely shocked when I got asked to contribute to that publication and totally honored. Right. Because we worked on that during COVID and it was uh, shortly after the. A lot of the. His. The national attention to his refusal to stand for the national anthem during his career in the NFL and et cetera. So I was just like, oh my God, little ole missure. And I knew that because we were in the middle of COVID I wanted to do something. Yeah. That was about, uh, the role of prisons and disease, uh, outbreaks. Right. And to think about prisons not just as. It being an accidental sort of advent of our criminal justice system, but actually it’s really part of it that there are a lot of infectious disease spreads happens because of the poor conditions that people in prison have to deal with. So. So yes, it was. Yeah, I was completely humbled to work on that piece for the book. And so I unfortunately didn’t get to actually meet him in person. It was just like edits through, you know, through emails and that sort of thing. But very, very pleased at how the entire book came about. And I think there’s a lot of great pieces in it. So yeah, it was very happy to be part of it. And I think the lesson, I think that Colin Kaepernick I think demonstrates for all of us, but certainly people who are uh, celebrities, whether athletes, pop stars, people who have large platforms that history may come around to prove you right. Right. Even in the midst of so much derision and targeting and harassment and ah, violence frankly, that staying the course, when you know that you are holding the ground towards a greater moral cause, an ethical cause, will actually pay off in the end. Right. So I think that’s the lesson. And also to. For people to then not be afraid of losing whatever sort of endorsements or a sports contract or those kind of things for the sake of going along to get along. Right. And I, I think his real leadership has been in his ability to stay committed to his. His beliefs and, and his. His moral center, despite what the rest of the world would have had him do.

Daniel (00:28:19 –> 00:28:24):
100%. A lesson I think needs to be applied still today. Right.

Mattie (00:28:25 –> 00:28:46):
Most def. So Kenyon, you have shared A lot about your political and your writing. Now it’s time to get down to the nitty gritty and juiciness, uh, of, uh, who you are. Are you going to have a little short rapid fire game with us?

Kenyon (00:28:47 –> 00:28:47):
I’m down.

Mattie (00:28:49 –> 00:29:06):
Well, you already know the rules to the game because you are our fellow co host of the show. So we’re going to ask you a series of questions. You do not get to think about it. You have to just answer off time, top of your head. Okay. And just like you did me in my interview. Oh, I’m coming for you, baby. I promise you. Okay?

Kenyon (00:29:07 –> 00:29:07):
Oh, Lord.

Mattie (00:29:07 –> 00:29:08):
Okay.

Kenyon (00:29:10 –> 00:29:11):
All right, bring it.

Daniel (00:29:12 –> 00:29:17):
All right, first question. 1. One writer you always go back to for inspiration.

Kenyon (00:29:17 –> 00:29:19):
James Baldwin, period.

Mattie (00:29:19 –> 00:29:23):
Oh, yes, very good. One favorite color and why black?

Kenyon (00:29:25 –> 00:29:47):
Mostly because I wear black all the time. Is a joke amongst a lot of my friends. Like, I wear black, but honestly, really, my favorite color color is orange because it’s. I also look good in orange. But also it’s, uh, it’s so. It’s. It’s a sunrise. It’s. It’s brightness. It’s newness. It’s. I love orange as a color.

Daniel (00:29:47 –> 00:29:50):
You and RuPaul. She loves orange, too.

Kenyon (00:29:50 –> 00:29:52):
Yeah, we’re both Scorpios, too. Maybe that’s it.

Daniel (00:29:53 –> 00:29:55):
Oh, I’m a Scorpio too. What’s your birthday?

Kenyon (00:29:55 –> 00:29:56):
November 13th.

Daniel (00:29:57 –> 00:29:58):
Okay, 8.

Mattie (00:29:58 –> 00:30:04):
No, nobody like all y’ all Scorpios, Honey, y’ all know Leos are the best. Go ahead. We’re gonna finish the conversation later.

Daniel (00:30:05 –> 00:30:11):
Everyone loves Scorpios one way or the other. What is a song in the opening credits of your biopic?

Mattie (00:30:11 –> 00:30:13):
Ooh, wow.

Kenyon (00:30:13 –> 00:30:24):
Oh, my God. You talking to a real music nerd. I gotta. Did a whole interview about music. Uh, wow, there’s so many, uh. This is really hard because I have.

Mattie (00:30:24 –> 00:30:25):
That is a hard question.

Daniel (00:30:26 –> 00:30:27):
Yeah, don’t overthink it.

Kenyon (00:30:28 –> 00:30:47):
Yeah. Okay. This is what it is. And this is going to be one people going to have to Google if you don’t really know house music like that. But I would say my theme music for like the opening credit. The opening credits of my film would be the Bucketheads, a song called the Bomb. The that these sounds fall into my mind.

Daniel (00:30:47 –> 00:30:49):
Oh, yes. Love that song.

Mattie (00:30:52 –> 00:30:54):
I did not know the name of it, but I knew this.

Daniel (00:30:56 –> 00:30:57):
Oh, my God.

Kenyon (00:30:57 –> 00:31:13):
That was like. Came out when I was in. In undergrad in the 90s. And that was just like. That was like me and my homies. That was like our theme songs with this. We always like. We and years later, some of you would, like, literally walk into restaurants, and that would be the song that was playing. So I feel like it’s. It stuck with us. So, so good.

Mattie (00:31:14 –> 00:31:19):
Anything house genre is going to be amazing, period. So I’m a househead, so.

Kenyon (00:31:20 –> 00:31:20):
Me too.

Mattie (00:31:20 –> 00:31:40):
Jersey, house music, Baltimore, all of it. Like, I am truly a house head, so. Okay, Kenya, so you’re sleeping style. Okay. And not to think of how you lay rotate, but I want to know, did you wear pajamas or do you stay in what God created to be your beautiful birthday suit?

Kenyon (00:31:40 –> 00:31:42):
Oh, I sleep in the nude, baby.

Mattie (00:31:43 –> 00:32:00):
Yes. Uh, yes. I mean, it’s a must, though. I think a lot of people don’t realize how important it is to sleep in the nude, especially if you’re an active sleeper like me, because if I sleep in clothes, I get hemmed up and stuff. So I need to be able to breathe and let everything just flow. But go ahead, Daniel, before I tell too much of my business.

Daniel (00:32:03 –> 00:32:13):
It’s fine. It’s actually the. It’s the airing laundry section of the podcast. Because the next question is, what’s your biggest turnoff?

Mattie (00:32:14 –> 00:32:17):
Oh, here comes the Scorpio. Go ahead.

Kenyon (00:32:17 –> 00:33:20):
Yeah, no, but it’s not okay. It’s like. Yeah, I would say. All right, so we talking like a, uh, kind of a personality thing is the biggest turnover this. Had this conversation last night. People who are. People who are rude to people in service, whether they are servers, gas station attendants, whatever. I have many a first date has ended with me in my mind when somebody was unnecessarily rude to somebody who was in service of them. And I tell people, I’m like, don’t let these essays and my education, all those stuff fool you. Like, I grew up in the projects, right? And my mom’s like, first job after my parents split when I was five years old was making sandwiches in a deli in downtown Cleveland. So I don’t play. Play. I don’t play no elitist. And that’s like. That’s like the first turn off. I say the other like another. Another. Just like a kind of a more petty turn off is bad breath.

Mattie (00:33:23 –> 00:33:36):
No, that’s not that. No, that’s. That’s definitely. Oh, uh, yeah. No, no, no, because how do you. How do you even try to have a intimate conversation with someone and they got hella toasted? Like, that’s not cute, right?

Kenyon (00:33:37 –> 00:33:39):
My God. Yeah, that’s really. Yeah.

Mattie (00:33:41 –> 00:33:53):
Okay, so my next question actually is not one of the rapid fire questions, but it’s just a segue question since we Just had this, um, conversation. But what is a. I would say, what was your worst first date experience?

Kenyon (00:33:54 –> 00:34:34):
Oh, God, I can’t believe I’m going to tell this. It’s actually. It’s actually a short story. So I. I would probably say the worst was going on a first date with somebody that I met online. This is also when I lived in New York some years ago. And I’m at the restaurant, like, waiting. I’m, like, waiting outside, like, the door for the other person to arrive, and I see the person across the street, and, like, this is gonna make me sound so shallow, but I, uh. But it. But it wasn’t, like, shallow. Just. It was the fact that I knew. I knew it was them, but I knew I had been absolutely catfished.

Mattie (00:34:35 –> 00:34:36):
And it was.

Kenyon (00:34:37 –> 00:34:50):
It was like, a moment where I had had, like, a few catfish experiences right through. This is, like, probably. This is, like, pre Grinder Adam and, like, Jack. This is, like, probably Adam for Adam, so. Or something like that.

Mattie (00:34:50 –> 00:34:56):
All the way back, I still did manhunt.

Kenyon (00:34:57 –> 00:35:15):
It was, like, back in the day, right. One of the. One of the websites before. Before smartphones. So, yeah, I. It was like a moment. It was not just that I was catfished in that moment, but it was like I had had several catfished experiences or whatever, and I was like, this is it.

Mattie (00:35:15 –> 00:35:16):
This is the last straw.

Kenyon (00:35:17 –> 00:35:27):
And I just, like, left without. Like, they didn’t see me there. Uh, but I. I saw them, like, a block or two up the street, and. And I just, like, left.

Mattie (00:35:29 –> 00:35:34):
So that was probably my worst part. Daniel, have you ever dipped out on a date?

Daniel (00:35:35 –> 00:35:37):
No. No.

Kenyon (00:35:37 –> 00:35:39):
Oh, God, I’m an awful person.

Mattie (00:35:40 –> 00:35:42):
No, you’re not awful.

Kenyon (00:35:43 –> 00:35:43):
I, uh.

Daniel (00:35:44 –> 00:35:47):
If I got catfish, I would probably confront them, though.

Kenyon (00:35:47 –> 00:35:51):
I thought about it for a split. For a split second, but I was.

Mattie (00:35:51 –> 00:35:52):
Like, you know what?

Kenyon (00:35:52 –> 00:36:12):
Like, also, like, I’m really not. And I’m not. I’m not saying that you’re, like, mean for doing that, but I just, like, I. Yeah, I just, like, I don’t want them to. I don’t want to do that. Like, I don’t want. Because people catfish often for a whole range of. They feel too old. Their bodies don’t fall. You know, there’s a range of things that, like. And so I can be.

Mattie (00:36:12 –> 00:36:15):
But that don’t justify it. No, that doesn’t justify.

Kenyon (00:36:16 –> 00:36:40):
But it don’t justify it. But I still, in my. Even in my, like, kind of Scorpio whatever, I still almost. I’m a softy, really, when it comes down to it. And so I felt bad enough, but I was felt. But I was also clear about what my boundary was at that point because I, it happened to me several times like uh, a recent period at that moment. So I was like, I’m not doing this. I have to like set a boundary even without like confronting them.

Daniel (00:36:40 –> 00:36:42):
Guilt is not very Scorpio. Like.

Mattie (00:36:45 –> 00:36:46):
Yeah, it’s not.

Daniel (00:36:46 –> 00:36:56):
That’s not, that’s not very much like us. All right, we just have a couple more questions for uh, this pod. I’m just gonna ask you. What’s your next passion project?

Kenyon (00:36:57 –> 00:38:20):
Well, well, uh, there’s, I mean there’s a couple of things that I haven’t started that are in my head. Obviously the memoir is one. And also I have, I started a project some years ago with a person that I’m no longer friends with. Uh, there’s actually a screenplay and I think I kind of want to revisit the idea around it, but it would be different. The initial idea actually started as to like write a screenplay about Billy Strayhorn who uh, just quickly was pianist and arranger and was Duke Ellington’s right hand man and chose and actually a lot of famous songs that people attribute to uh, Duke Ellington actually. Billy Strayhorn wrote like Take the A Train, Satin Doll, a whole bunch of songs. Yeah, he actually wrote those and he made a decision to, to actually stay behind Duke Ellington for most of his career because he was out as a gay man in the working uh, in the 40s and 50s and 60s. He died in the late 60s because he wanted to be able to still live his life as a gay man in that time without whatever. So. And he was also best friends with Lena Horne. Lena Horne said that had, had Billy Strayhorn not been gay, that’s who she would have married. But that was like her.

Mattie (00:38:20 –> 00:38:21):
Oh, can I play Lena?

Kenyon (00:38:23 –> 00:39:32):
Yes. And so there’s something about. So I do kind of want to return now. There’s a couple. I just saw a play in Pittsburgh, which is where Billy Strayhorn was originally from, about Billy Strahan. There’s been a little bit more of attention paid to him. But I’m, I’ve been toying with this idea for long enough that I’m, Yeah, I’m thinking about it. So that’s, that’s, that would be Patrick’s project. And I’m also a huge Lena Horne fan. Like I’m a huge. I just take Rick, my mom. When Lena Horne passed, my mom called me in the morning at like 7 in the morning and I answered the phone. I had already Seen it. Cause I was up and she was like, oh, hey, I’m sorry, I thought you weren’t gonna answer the phone, but I just had to call and leave you a message. Cause I just saw Lena Horne pass and I know what a huge Lena Horne fan you’ve been your entire life. And my mother got jokes. My mother was like. And I was just calling to make sure my son didn’t throw himself off a balcony or swallow a handful of pills. And I said, listen, old lady. I was like, I didn’t say nothing to you. I said, look, if Andrew’s dad. I didn’t make fun of your ass because you was ready to like run to New York and throw yourself like in the casket.

Daniel (00:39:34 –> 00:39:39):
So anyway, just like the drama. The drama. Mhm.

Kenyon (00:39:39 –> 00:39:42):
Yeah, yeah. My family is. We, we got jokes for each other.

Mattie (00:39:42 –> 00:39:44):
So I love it.

Kenyon (00:39:44 –> 00:39:45):
I love it.

Mattie (00:39:45 –> 00:39:56):
Look, if you can’t talk shit to the ones you love, then who the hell can you talk shit to? I’m just gonna be honest, period. Right. Well, Kenyon, where can people find out about all your activities? What are your social media handles?

Kenyon (00:39:57 –> 00:40:29):
Yeah, so you can. Yeah, finally. Really? On all the socials, it’s the same, it’s just my name, Kenyon Pharaoh kenyonferrow. I is very basic as hell, so I’m uh, pretty easy to find in that respect. So yeah, all Facebook, Blue Sky, Instagram. I still kept my head, my Twitter account, but I don’t fuck with it because Elon Musk. But I didn’t want nobody to steal it and then start tweeting shit with pretending to be me. So I kept it open, but I don’t use it. But you can find me on everything at Kenya Farrell.

Daniel (00:40:29 –> 00:40:55):
Awesome. Well, that’s all the time we have for this episode of Power Beyond Pride. Thank you so much for joining us today. It’s been a delight, a fierce delight. I’m your co host Daniel and you can follow me@danielwklee.com or on uh, Instagram at Strongplum Strong P L U m. Alrighty then, Mr.

Mattie (00:40:55 –> 00:41:23):
Plum. All right, I guess I’ll be the peach and summon a Georgianian and North Carolinian. Anywho, but I am Maddie, your other co host with the mostest and you can follow me at. Ah, maddysimone737 on Instagram and Maddie Bynum on Facebook. I also want to thank you Kenya, one more time for just coming and delighting us with your beautiful bright presence. Thank you so, so much for coming and being with us.

Kenyon (00:41:24 –> 00:41:27):
My absolute pleasure. So glad to be working with y’ all. So thank you.

Mattie (00:41:28 –> 00:41:51):
Love it. And to our, uh, listeners, thank you so much for being a, um, great audience to listen to us. Because if it isn’t for you, then we wouldn’t have jobs to do what we do. Okay, so a little homework for y’ all is to remember to subscribe and always tell your friends to subscribe and join and come and hang out with us too. You can go to Power Beyond Pride wherever you get your podcast and you can check us out on our website.

Daniel (00:41:51 –> 00:42:03):
Powerbeyondprod.Com Power Beyond Pride is a project from A Great Idea, a queer owned design and content agency. Learn more about them at A Great Idea Dot com.

Mattie (00:42:03 –> 00:42:13):
This episode is produced by Shane Lucas. Tamita Sarka is the project developer. Uh, our editor is Jared Redding with support from the wonderful Ian Wilson.

Daniel (00:42:15 –> 00:42:22):
We are both part of this podcast host team and we invite you to send in your questions and comments at powerbeyondpride.

Kenyon (00:42:22 –> 00:42:23):
Com.

Mattie (00:42:23 –> 00:42:30):
Uh, and as always, we look forward to clear change making with you at Power Beyond Pride.